Puget Systems and iBUYPOWER: two sides of the system integrator coin
by Jarred Walton on February 15, 2007 10:25 AM EST- Posted in
- Systems
iBUYPOWER: Reliability, Warranty and Support
If pure performance isn't the benchmark by which systems are to be compared, reliability and technical support have to move to the forefront of considerations. How do the iBUYPOWER systems stack up in these areas? There are some good aspects as well as a few problems that we encountered, but certainly nothing that we would consider a deal breaker.
Let's start with reliability. The midrange system had no problems whatsoever throughout our testing. We ran a variety of stress tests, including various complex games, and not once did we have any issues with stability. The high-end configuration was almost as good, except one morning we came out to find that the system wouldn't power on. After doing a bit of troubleshooting, we were able to determine that the power supply was dead. What caused the failure? It could have been a flaky component or a substandard power supply, but there were also some power outages occurring around the time the PSU failed that were caused by severe rain/wind storms. None of our other test computers had problems, but it's possible that this particular system was plugged into an outlet that got a bit more of a surge during one of the numerous brownouts. When we called tech support and "played dumb," they eventually reached the same conclusion and at that point we would have normally sent the system back for repairs. However, the test configuration (quad core with CrossFire graphics) was such that we would have ended up scratching the review altogether. The reliability of the power supply could have been better, but the level of support that we were offered was good and would have fixed the problem.
All of the iBUYPOWER systems come with a standard 3-year warranty, as we mentioned earlier. It's great that everyone gets that level of support without having to spend extra money, but some people would prefer to have the option to spend a bit more for on-site service as well. As it stands, repairs have to be completed by iBUYPOWER, which means you have pay to send the computer back to the factory for repairs, and iBUYPOWER more will pay for return shipping. Turnaround time tends to be around 7 to 10 business days, so if your computer is your livelihood that's probably insufficient unless you have a backup computer. That's the advantage of many of the large OEMs: they have various business agreements so that you can get next-day on-site service as part of the warranty coverage.
Besides actual repairs, we also like to test out the customer service and support department. One of the first problems that we immediately discovered is that it's a bit tricky trying to figure out how to contact technical support. The iBUYPOWER web page doesn't place the support link in a prominent location. Normally, customer service links are located near the top of company web pages, but in this case you have to go to the very bottom of the web page and click on the very small "Service" link. That takes you to a page where you can then select "Technical Support" to get the necessary contact information. Email support is also available from the service page. Like many smaller companies, technical support is only provided during the week: Monday through Friday, 8:30 a.m. to 5:00 p.m. PST. Other than email, iBUYPOWER doesn't provide any other support options.
We called up the support department several times during testing to see what sort of hold times we would get as well as to grade their support quality. Wait times weren't too bad, averaging four or five minutes in most cases, but we were usually informed by a recording that there were "excessive calls" and that the hold time would be 15 to 20 minutes. The longest we ever had to wait was about seven minutes, however. The overall quality of the support was okay, but we didn't really feel that they went beyond the call of duty. Most of the time, the support personnel spoke English with an accent that made communication somewhat difficult, and at times we weren't entirely sure they understood our problem so there was frequently repeating/restating of the situation. Once we were able to overcome the communication barrier, the answers they provided were generally correct, but they weren't always necessarily the best solution.
For example, when confronted with a potential spyware infection, the initial advice was to simply reformat our hard drive. When asked how to do that, we were told to simply restart the computer with our Windows XP CD in the optical drive and follow the instructions. Only after a bit more talking (during which the support person seem to be anxious to get off the phone) did the possibility of using anti-spyware software come up (they recommended "Adware", not AdAware), and we never did get clear advice suggesting that we backup any important files or documents before reformatting.
That was perhaps the worst of the support calls, and we should mention that quite a few companies will simply refuse to help with any software issues like viruses or spyware. Our support calls related to hardware problems, driver issues, and other general advice were better, but we never really did feel like the support personnel wanted to help us. In most cases, they could give the correct answer eventually, but either because of the communication barrier or some other factor we would have to rate the overall support experience as merely average.
Getting a standard 3-year warranty without having to spend a lot of extra money isn't a bad deal, but the level of support provided definitely wasn't as good as many of their competitors. There were no support forums that we could find, and there wasn't an option to have a technician remotely control the PC in order to provide help. Support hours are also relatively limited, and while they should be sufficient for most people anyone that needs more handholding will definitely want to look at a company that can provide at least some amount of support over the weekends. On-site support as an upgraded option would also make their systems far more attractive to business/home-office users. In essence, iBUYPOWER provides a reasonable level of support but nothing particularly noteworthy. They get the job done, and that's about it. Given their extremely competitive pricing, we really aren't particularly surprised; companies that provide high-quality support generally have to charge more for their computers.
If pure performance isn't the benchmark by which systems are to be compared, reliability and technical support have to move to the forefront of considerations. How do the iBUYPOWER systems stack up in these areas? There are some good aspects as well as a few problems that we encountered, but certainly nothing that we would consider a deal breaker.
Let's start with reliability. The midrange system had no problems whatsoever throughout our testing. We ran a variety of stress tests, including various complex games, and not once did we have any issues with stability. The high-end configuration was almost as good, except one morning we came out to find that the system wouldn't power on. After doing a bit of troubleshooting, we were able to determine that the power supply was dead. What caused the failure? It could have been a flaky component or a substandard power supply, but there were also some power outages occurring around the time the PSU failed that were caused by severe rain/wind storms. None of our other test computers had problems, but it's possible that this particular system was plugged into an outlet that got a bit more of a surge during one of the numerous brownouts. When we called tech support and "played dumb," they eventually reached the same conclusion and at that point we would have normally sent the system back for repairs. However, the test configuration (quad core with CrossFire graphics) was such that we would have ended up scratching the review altogether. The reliability of the power supply could have been better, but the level of support that we were offered was good and would have fixed the problem.
All of the iBUYPOWER systems come with a standard 3-year warranty, as we mentioned earlier. It's great that everyone gets that level of support without having to spend extra money, but some people would prefer to have the option to spend a bit more for on-site service as well. As it stands, repairs have to be completed by iBUYPOWER, which means you have pay to send the computer back to the factory for repairs, and iBUYPOWER more will pay for return shipping. Turnaround time tends to be around 7 to 10 business days, so if your computer is your livelihood that's probably insufficient unless you have a backup computer. That's the advantage of many of the large OEMs: they have various business agreements so that you can get next-day on-site service as part of the warranty coverage.
Besides actual repairs, we also like to test out the customer service and support department. One of the first problems that we immediately discovered is that it's a bit tricky trying to figure out how to contact technical support. The iBUYPOWER web page doesn't place the support link in a prominent location. Normally, customer service links are located near the top of company web pages, but in this case you have to go to the very bottom of the web page and click on the very small "Service" link. That takes you to a page where you can then select "Technical Support" to get the necessary contact information. Email support is also available from the service page. Like many smaller companies, technical support is only provided during the week: Monday through Friday, 8:30 a.m. to 5:00 p.m. PST. Other than email, iBUYPOWER doesn't provide any other support options.
We called up the support department several times during testing to see what sort of hold times we would get as well as to grade their support quality. Wait times weren't too bad, averaging four or five minutes in most cases, but we were usually informed by a recording that there were "excessive calls" and that the hold time would be 15 to 20 minutes. The longest we ever had to wait was about seven minutes, however. The overall quality of the support was okay, but we didn't really feel that they went beyond the call of duty. Most of the time, the support personnel spoke English with an accent that made communication somewhat difficult, and at times we weren't entirely sure they understood our problem so there was frequently repeating/restating of the situation. Once we were able to overcome the communication barrier, the answers they provided were generally correct, but they weren't always necessarily the best solution.
For example, when confronted with a potential spyware infection, the initial advice was to simply reformat our hard drive. When asked how to do that, we were told to simply restart the computer with our Windows XP CD in the optical drive and follow the instructions. Only after a bit more talking (during which the support person seem to be anxious to get off the phone) did the possibility of using anti-spyware software come up (they recommended "Adware", not AdAware), and we never did get clear advice suggesting that we backup any important files or documents before reformatting.
That was perhaps the worst of the support calls, and we should mention that quite a few companies will simply refuse to help with any software issues like viruses or spyware. Our support calls related to hardware problems, driver issues, and other general advice were better, but we never really did feel like the support personnel wanted to help us. In most cases, they could give the correct answer eventually, but either because of the communication barrier or some other factor we would have to rate the overall support experience as merely average.
Getting a standard 3-year warranty without having to spend a lot of extra money isn't a bad deal, but the level of support provided definitely wasn't as good as many of their competitors. There were no support forums that we could find, and there wasn't an option to have a technician remotely control the PC in order to provide help. Support hours are also relatively limited, and while they should be sufficient for most people anyone that needs more handholding will definitely want to look at a company that can provide at least some amount of support over the weekends. On-site support as an upgraded option would also make their systems far more attractive to business/home-office users. In essence, iBUYPOWER provides a reasonable level of support but nothing particularly noteworthy. They get the job done, and that's about it. Given their extremely competitive pricing, we really aren't particularly surprised; companies that provide high-quality support generally have to charge more for their computers.
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EvErywhErE - Saturday, October 25, 2008 - link
Great Article on Pudget! I stumbled accross them quite by accident last month after my work machine melted down... I was tight for time, didn't want to think about anything, and was planning on doing just a litle internet research to see if anyone could beat Dell for general price, performance, warrenty, and ease of assembly.I was instantly impressed with the pudget website, and the fact that a real person picked up the phone and seemed to know exactly what I needed. I explained that I was an mechanical engineer and that the machine would be used for CAD work about 90% of the time. 10 minutes later I recieved an e-mail link to a custom computer that served as a great starting point. I did just a little customizing and really felt quite happy knowing that I didn't have to spend the rest of my day weighing performance, stability, and an unknown amount of time troubleshooting that one unexpected thing.
I ended up going with an Intel Core 2 Quad Q9400 Quad-Core 2.66GHz, an Asus P5Q-E mother board, Quadro FX 1700, and 4Gig of ram. Not the most amazing machine out there, but more than enough to keep me working for another year or two.
As luck would have it my modest workstation proved to be a nightmare to get up and running... In the end it took a full 4 weeks to get everything up and running. This included some hardware shipping delays, swapping of memory, OS choices (xp64, then Vista 64) swapping the motherboard, and eventually solving the problem with a Bios update.
Needless to say I've gone through many levels of frustration during the whole process, but at the same time I really have felt supported by pudget the whole time. My contact person has been quick with updates most of the time, and has always been good at not making promises that he couldn't keep.
In the last week I've spent so much time researching computer components that I decided to just build my own one more time, and when I realized how huge my mark up was it really did make even more sense. But there really is a bit of irony though because my last machine was painstakingly built up with the help of a knowledgeable friend for the exact same purpose and I had a bios gremlin the haunted me for the past 3 years...
So to bring this long story to a finish, I sent an e-mail to Pudget today saying that after a lot of thought, too much computer research, and of course way too much waiting, I'd decided to cancle the order. This had already been discussed previously and the plan was to make a final decision today. I recieved a very nice call from a manager just an hour or so later who was very sympathetic to the whole situation.
As it turned out my computer had finally made ith though the last phase of QA and was ready to ship. Considering all I'd been through he offered to ship it next day for free and let me demo the machine with an unconditional 30 return and no restocking fee. At the moment I'm still pretty set on the idea of building an SLI machine myself- but at the same time I realized that even in this worst of all imaginable scenerios, I as a customer never felt negleted. That's a really had thing to find these days even in the best of situations, so to find a company that really did manage to fall flat on their face in terms of expectations, but still maintain customer support and confidence is really something that stands out.
About 10 minutes after I got off the phone I recieved an email summary of my newly completed system complete with thermal images in both an idle and loaded configuration. It's just a little touch, but really that is what makes the difference between high quality and useless junk. My new test drive toy should arrive monday morning; I can't decide if I want to to be amazing, or if I want to need a little more. I guess too much geeking out on specs the last week has really started to sink in. Either way it's nice to know that there's a whole crew of people to support me regardless of my decision.
Pudget definately isn't the cheapest, and they don't offer every component known to man, but if you're in the market for a team of people that will take the time to do the job right, and provide quality human interaction the whole way through the process they may be a very good choice.
Metal Face - Monday, February 26, 2007 - link
It looks like Puget may have scrapped their Certified Systems programicthy - Friday, February 16, 2007 - link
I've been considering buying a computer from Puget Systems for some time now, so I was quite glad to see the article. I especially appreciate that you calculated the markup for a computer, although it would have been nice to see some details. Also, I want to mention the reason I've considered Puget Systems is they'll build a top of the line linux computer, which is nice because then you don't have to worry about issues with compatability and cutting-edge hardware. I'd like to offer the friendly suggestion that this would have been a useful piece of information for the article, as it's rather difficult to find a computer vendor that will build something that will be guaranteed for linux.Finally, I'd suggest checking out Envision Computer Solutions for a future article along these lines. I bought a PC from them and was very impressed. (Note: I have absolutely no personal or business relationship with them).
Imnotrichey - Friday, February 16, 2007 - link
yikes, i didnt see that part. 25% markup seems a bit extreme.JarredWalton - Friday, February 16, 2007 - link
Check out VoodooPC, Falcon Northwest, Alienware, and anyone else like that. Some of them seem to be about a 50% markup - and yes, I'm accounting for the cost of their custom paint jobs (where applicable).Imnotrichey - Friday, February 16, 2007 - link
Yes, I'm sure you are correct that this is better than those others. Just surprising to me, since I never looked into it. 5-10% I could understand, but making a 2000 buck system cost 2500 just doesn't seem worth it. Seems like someone would slip under that 25% mark up and force them to compete at that level.JeffDM - Sunday, February 18, 2007 - link
Given the costs of doing business, I really don't think it's extreme.In your example, the $2000 "system" isn't really a system, it is really just a pile of parts. It's part of the $500 extra that makes it into a system, the rest have to go to business expenses. The labor, procurement, warranty and support aren't free. There are a host of other business expenses in there too, running a business is not cheap.
runestone - Saturday, February 17, 2007 - link
I live in the nearby area of Puget Systems, here's my .02: when the A8nE-sli boards came out, they were hard to get. I noticed they had some; called them and got a quote of 275$, well past my threshold of gouging. I found one a day later for 100 less.I guess if you have the money to blow they have some nice systems.
anandtech02148 - Friday, February 16, 2007 - link
good taste, always begins with a computer case. Puget got it.Imnotrichey - Friday, February 16, 2007 - link
I agree, Puget system seems to give you so many top notch choices